Posts by Jeremy C

18

Are there any contracts signed between the WTS and its members?

by RULES & REGULATIONS in

i don't remember if i signed any papers stating that i would be a member of the jehovah's witnesses when i was baptized 30 years ago.

do elders,ministerial servants,pioneers,or bethel workers ever sign a contract stating what position they will hold?

if no contracts are ever signed,how can the wts enforce disfellowshipping of any of its members?

Jeremy C

I wonder if getting baptized itself is a "contract".

In a sense yes, however, it is a contractual agreement to subject oneself to the organization's "religious court" system (i.e. judicial committees).

Has anyone ever wondered why after so many years, the Society saw fit to change the baptismal questions to include the verbal acknowledgement of being baptized into the organization? The Society's reasons were not purely theological. There were legal ramifications involved.

Ray Franz revealed that shortly before the Society changed the baptismal questions (in 1985), there were U.S. Supreme Court decisions which concluded that a member of a religious organization can be made subject to its internal courts without due process afforded under the U.S. Constitution.

Some Jehovah's Witnesses it the past had responded to judicial committee summons by hiring an attorney to send the body of elders a letter instructing them to discontinue correspondence with the member and to deal exclusively with legal council. This created legal hassles for not only the local bodies of elders, but for the branches, and headquarters.

Under the new U.S. Supreme Court decisions however, a member could be subjected to religious tribunals without legal representation. Such decisions protected religious organizations that practice ex-communication from costly litigation.

So, the Society changed the wording of the baptismal questions in order to shield themselves (and the local congregations) from lawsuits by those who were disfellowshipped. Ray Franz in his book "In Search of Christian Freedom", revealed that the Society's legal department has crafted a lengthy legal package that is mailed to attorneys who might be hired by an indivdual Witness who challenges a judicial committee. The legal package makes references to the U.S. Supreme Court decisions, as well as the legally binding "contractual" relationship that the individual JW member entered into upon their baptism.

This is one case in which the Jehovah's Witnesses are now officially (and legally) a religion with a clergy and laity. It's interesting that this kind of arrangement was denounced by C.T. Russell and Judge Rutherford as one of the characteristics of Christendome. However, as has been the case with so many other issues in the Watchtower organization, cynical pragmaticism has won out over strict Biblical adherence.

28

Captives of a Concept

by Mickey mouse in

jw
friends

what a fantastic book!

i really enjoyed it.

i loved the way don cameron refused to get bogged down with arguing for an alternative scriptural interpretation to the witnesses.

Jeremy C

The basic thrust of Cameron's argument was to deconstruct the Watchtower's claim that they were serving the kind of "proper food" at the "proper time" that would pass Christ's inspection.

As he points out rather succinctly, the Watchtower was not publishing proper information at the time of the supposed inspection of Christ. Their teachings did not differ much from that of the Second Adventists of the time. At the time of the supposed inspection by Christ Jesus, they were still teaching that Jesus was enthroned in 1874 - another carry over from the Adventist movement.

The very foundation of the "Faithful Slave" teaching comes down to the 1919 appointment by Christ. Regardless of what has been taught in the last 90 years, the question remains - did this divine "selection" really take place. As Cameron points out (through pointing out all of their sloppy teachings at the time); the "spiritual food" being served at that time was hardly anything to be proud of; and with all of the falshoods that it contained; was nothing that could be considered to be superior over other Adventist-style groups.

Ray Franz in his book In Search of Christian Freedom, devoted an entire chapter to the concept of the Faithful Slave with it's 1919 appointment. After considering all of the evidence, Franz very bluntly referred to the published teachings as "immaginative silliness". He also stated that it was "an insult to Christ Jesus" to claim that he had chosen this organization based upon what they were publishing at this time.

No wonder Kingdom Hall libraries have purged all of the works by Russell and Rutherford. If all of the teachings of the time were so illustrious as to garner Christ's favor; why is it that these published books can only be found in "apostates" attics and on E-bay?

18

JW's are the least tolerant and least open minded of all religions!

by Gill in

jw
friends

http://www.cultnews.com/.

i hope this link works!.

but jws are the least open minded and least tolerant of all religions!

Jeremy C

The issue of tolerance is an interesting aspect of the Watchtower organization. The Watchtower leadership does indeed promote a generous and liberal amount of tolerance . . . . . . for itself.

Jehovah's Witnesses (at least those in good standing) demonstrate their theocratic worthiness and good spiritual health by highlighting every flaw and mistep in the churches of Christendom. The Awake magazine's "Watching the World" section is quick to seize upon unflattering news of another church; however trivial it might be in the larger scheme of things. Jehovah's Witnesses take jubilation in denouncing and rideculing other Christians.

Yet, there is a bizarre alter-ego not only within individual JWs, but also in the collective organization. This other side of their personality is very swift to show an apologetic tolerance for any scandal, doctrinal flip-flop, or any unflattering aspect of the organization; including blatant false predictions. The organization and its members are very adept at performing a rhetorical tap-dance to justify, rationalize, and excuse any faults of the Watchtower.

Therefore, JWs could argue that they are probably the most tolerant religious group in the world. I would tend to agree with them. If one is talking about tolerating the promotion of false expectations, false teachings, pharisaical legalism, arrogant elitism, mind control, and fantastical nonsense disguised as the Christian gospel; then I say hand them a trophy . . . . . they've earned it.

94

The growing irrelevance of the Watchtower message

by drew sagan in

in many ways it appears as if the watchtower movement is slowing down.

a number of changes over the last few years certainly show that the watchtower is in a period of transition.

they have cut back on the number of magazines they print as well as lowered the cost of production by eliminating things like hard backed books.

Jeremy C

There is another major issue that the Watchtower refuses to address. They refuse to adopt and implement many of the social support mechanisms (such as support groups) that other large churches offer to their members.

I attended a large church in my area that offered over a dozen free support groups for it's members: support groups for single mothers, for those suffering from depression, groups for fathers, those struggling with drinking problems, and groups that were specifically designed for youngsters and teenagers. The Watchtower organization offers nothing of this sort. Not only do they refuse to allow these kinds of arrangements, but they subtly infer that any discouragement is the fault of the member; that they need to have a better appreciation of the "spiritual paradise".

On the Watchtower's treadmill of activity, there is a "one size fits all" system of uniformity that ignores many of the unique and diverse needs of it's members. I believe that this is why so many people give up their activity in the organization out of sheer exhaustion, depression, and discouragement. It is also why so many youths just are not invigorated or inspired very much.

The Watchtower organization could learn a thing or two from other churches. However, they will continue denounce such "time wasters" that are practiced in Christendom. They will continue to swear by their spiritual superiority complex and fail to provide the true and meaningful spiritual enrichment that could have retained the countless numbers who have left and continue to leave. Pride certainly does cometh before the fall.

21

Watchtower: End Game Strategy?

by sacolton in

most cults don't go out with a whisper when they know their time has come.

jonestown.

branch davidians.

Jeremy C

I believe that the question is based upon a faulty premise. There is no reason to believe that the Watchtower organization will experience a massive "Enron-style" implosion. In the future, the organization will surely implement more structural "re-organizations" and operational "adjustments", but there is no reason to predict a massive dismantling of the organizational structure as a whole.

There will also be further doctrinal fiddling and flip-flops done by the GB, but there is no reason to foresee any kind of Jonestown-style meltdown within the ranks. I believe that these kind of immaginative and fanciful speculations are the result of wishful thinking, over-active immaginations, and JW conditioning itself. Remember that we all come from an apocalyptic group that is always predicting the chaotic unraveling of "this system of things" - a system of things that they deeply resent. It is not hard to see that many of us former members have continued to carry this "chicken little" style of thinking as mental residue and attempt to apply it to the organization that we resent.

Consider this point: think about all of the doctrinal nonsense that is foisted upon the members of the Mormom Church. Look at that church's history of major controversies, upheavels, public scrutiny, and the splitting off of many of its members. Has that church gone through any kind of chaotic downfall? Hardly. In fact, they continue to gain converts in many poorer uneducated countries - the same way that the Watchtower is.

I just do not believe that it is rational or mature to predict a major collapse of the Watchtower with it hanging a "going out of business" sign on it's front door. I believe that we are deluding ourselves if we are expecting this, or hanging our hopes upon this kind of event. The Watchtower organization has millions of people who have an exraordinary emotional investment in the ideology that it sells. There are millions of people all over the world who want to believe in the concept of organizational exclusivity, spiritual "specialness", and future utopia. It is this very human nature that will not allow Watchtower ideology to die anytime soon.

25

Watchtower Blood Component/Fraction Deception

by jwfacts in

the watchtower attempts to create a semblance of logic to its allowance of blood fractions by presenting the concept that blood consists of four primary "components".

use of these components are unchristian.

these components can be broken into "fractions", which are acceptable to use.

Jeremy C

The Bible writers were unaware of any of these definitions. Blood was not separated by a centrifuge. Blood was simply regarded as blood. To contain some semblance of logic, the Watchtower should either allow blood use, or not allow it - in any form. If it wishes to disallow whole blood but (somewhat illogically) allow blood fractions, then all fractions should be considered acceptable, including red and white cells.

Common sense logic would indeed call for them to draw such a line, but they cannot. The organization painted itself into a corner in two ways: doctrinally, and legally.

The organization has attempted to carry forward its tradition of the blood ban while having to deal with the ever-growing complexities posed to them by medical science. With the recent distinctions between plasma, fractions, and components; there has been a dizzying attempt on the part of the GB to ban what needs to banned, and allow what can be allowed. This process has created a legalistic maze of do's and dont's for the rank and file. Did Jehovah not anticipate all of this when he directed the organization to ban blood? All of this pharisaical maneuvering on the part of the GB makes God look quite confused.

I believe that the bigger issue posed to the GB is that of legalities. The legal department has written a lot of the blood policy, and continues to try to sheild the Watchtower from lawsuits. What if the GB were to suddenly lift the blood ban? I believe that the judgements against the organization for past JW deaths would make the pedophile judgements look like pocket change. So, the organization has painted itself into a legal corner as well. The Watchtower's blood rulings and sub-rulings have created a legalistic fiasco that is nothing short of shameful.

Meanwhile, JW lives (particularly those of children) hang in the balance over this idiotic process of nit-picking and hand-wringing on the part of the organizational leadership. All of this is quite similar to the first century Pharisees' endless rulings and man-made laws which created a legalistic nightmare for their followers. The ruling body in Jerusalem has merely relocated to Brooklyn Heights.

23

District Convention Observations

by TD in

jw
friends

i accompanied my jw wife to one day (sunday) of the district convention this weekend.

for any who are interested, i offer these observations from the sunday afternoon session:.

the concluding talk was given by a gentleman by the name of steven lett, a member of the jw governing body.

Jeremy C

1. He claimed that all dedicated, baptized Jehovah's Witnesses (And he included himself in this claim) have answered the following question in the affirmative:

Do you understand that your dedication and baptism identify you as one of Jehovah's Witnesses in association with God's spirit-directed organization?

This claim should have evoked laughter from anyone in the audience who had any critical thinking skills. There is not one verse in all of the New Testament which suggests that Christians were to be baptized into a congregation. Jesus words about baptizing converts in the name of the Father, Son, and the Holy Spirit were understood to be clear, unambiguous, and without need of clarification. The Apostles understood this as well; as their teachings regarding baptism were in compliance with Jesus' instructions. The apostles did not tack on additional requirements for Christian immersion. To take such liberties would have been viewed as "apostate" teachings, and causing divisions.

There was never any indication in the NT that converts were obligated to verbally acknowledge being baptized into the particular congregation doing the baptizing. Verbally acknowledging being baptized into a particular congregation was never a prerequisite for immersion, and was eventually written about by Paul as preaching a "new gospel". Paul rebuked those who began to demonstrate this trend toward giving allegiance to certain men. For those who began to place their allegiance to Paul above Christ; Paul sarcastically asked them: "Was I crucified for you?" and "were you baptized into the name of Paul?"

For over 1,900 years, true Christians knew what Christian baptism entailed. Christ's instructions were very clear and straightforward. There was never any need for an organization 1,900 years later to "clarify" Jesus' instructions regarding baptism. To feel qualified to overwrite Christ's own words is nothing short of arrogance.

Unfortunately, even the JW Governing Body don't read their Bibles enough. They are too infatuated with the perceived aura of the Writing Department as "God's channel. Unfortunately, there are too few in the organization who are able or willing to demonstrate the most basic of critical thinking skills needed to identify such fallacious rhetoric.

30

Condescending Style of the book Keep Yourselves in God's Love

by VM44 in

atlantis has posted a download link for the 2008 book release, "keep yourselves in god's love".

i read a page or so from the book, and the first thing i notices is the simple language used that sounds like it is written to be read by a little child who is in elemenatary school.. the styel if very condescending and actually is insulting as if the reader is expected to have a very low level of intelligence or reading ability.. what is going on?

why is bethel printing such material?.

Jeremy C

Many of us have noticed a dumbing-down trend in the books that are being published by the Watchtower. I first noticed this trend when the Knowledge book was published and was the official book being used to study with newly interested ones. I was a Regular Pioneer when this book was being used, and I was disturbed that we were expecting people to just renounce their faith and join our organization based upon such simplistic material.

Of course, the Watchtower believes there is Scriptural precedent for printing material that is simplistic. Their conventional wisdom says that only the "humble", and "meek" will demonstrate the sheeplike qualities in responding to the Kingdom message. Any people who would find Watchtower material to be childish, simplistic, or sophomoric are to be dismissed as "proud" and "self-satisfied" ones. This is how JWs can feel justified in discontinuing a "Bible" study with someone who does not "progress" to demonstrating a commitment to the organization after only a brief period of time.

This "take it or leave it" attitude is part of the spiritual elitism and self-serving arrogance that is fostered within the organization. The Watchtower organization is like a large corporation that has convinced its sales representatives that they have the best spiritual product on the market. If anyone rejects the product, it is because the prospective buyers are to "haughty" to accept the "truth". This is how the Watchtower gets away with publishing such nonsense.

In any multi-level marketing enterprise, it is always the dutifull sales reps who are the last ones to realize that they are selling a lemon.

283

News from Mother ship

by jefferywhat in

1. bethel in ny suspect high level apostate, cant identify it but know its there.

2. major organizational changes about to start rolling out, one is changes to the "service committee" and titles, po to be done away with, thats all i know for now.

was told that if you are the sort of person that cant handle changes, you wont stay in the org for long.

Jeremy C

Too many out-of-touch COs and DOs promote the rampant, trickle-down, extremism that drove me away. The local BOE pick up on this and often expect it from the congregation. Even Paul, obnoxious as he was, had to hold down a job. I think it'd be good for them to get back into the real world.

That is an interesting observation. I have often believed that the Governing Body should be made up of men who do not live at Bethel, but are elders who have to hold down jobs just like all of the other congregation elders. I firmly believe that organizational policy would be more Christ-like if the GB was comprised of men who know what it is like to have to secure employment, pay rent, pay for health care, and deal with the uncertanties of life that are not experienced by people in Bethel. Most of the GB are men who have spent decades in the traveling work or at branches where their needs were taken care of and paid for by the Society or the congregations.

Yes, working in the traveling work and working at Bethel can be stressful and tiring. But, when a centralized body who has been removed from the secular job climate for decades; decides to enforce draconian policies on people regarding education, there is a serious problem. I believe more and more JWs are becomming disturbed by this heavy-handed trend.

Ever since the institution of the Governing Body was established, many Witnesses have been quite aware of the disconnect between body members, and the circumstances of the rank and file. This is the big taboo that no one is allowed to talk about, lest they be accused of being a "fault finder".

This disconnect that exists is an issue, I believe, among body members themselves. Ray Franz himself stated in both of his books that some members were mindful of it, and attempted to be more liberal and empathetic to the brothers when making policy decisions. Other body members, however were too consumed with organizational efficiency and the politics of policy making to be concerned with such considerations. Some members want to place the least amount of burdens as possible on the brothers. Other members on the other hand, truly believe that JWs need to be tightly controlled and micro-managed in order to maintain a strong monolithic organizational structure.

This was an issue in many disagreements that arose within the GB while Ray Franz was on the body. It is not hard to figure out that such an issue is probably still alive and well among the GB today. Why are so many JW youths leaving the organization? Why is there so much depression among JWs? How do we encourage JWs to go out in service more? Such questions must bring about very different answers between those who are more liberal and empathetic from those who are more stern and punitive-minded.

11

Functionally Insane:The JW Altered Reality

by BreakingAway in

jw
friends

insane .

1.not sane; not of sound mind; mentally deranged.

2.of, pertaining to, or characteristic of a person who is mentally deranged: insane actions; an insane asylum.

Jeremy C

But all of this got me to thinking once again about the many I saw come out of Bethel that seemed to have some serious mental or emotional problems."But were they that way before they went to Bethel or was it a result of their experiences there ?" In looking at things more closely it seemed evident that it was their time spent there that brought on such an inner conflict.Many of them also seem to have drinking problems, as a way of coping I'd imagine.

I was at Bethel, and I did not see any higher number of eccentric people than one would see in the local congregations. I don't see any correlation between Bethel service and mental problems. Of all of the former Bethelites I know (many of them spending several years there), the vast majority are very normal and well adjusted people. Bethel is indeed a representation of local congregations. There are the quiet serious achievers, and there are the comical slackers. There are the very meek and kind-hearted souls; and there are the radically judgemental, could-hearted pricks.

There was however, an observation that many of us Bethelites made about unmarried brothes. Many of us noticed that the older brothers who had never been married (men from about the age of 50 on up) always displayed bizarre peculiarities. Just look at Fred Franz, for example. We noticed that most of them; although basically kind, showed a serious lack of social development, and irrational fetishes for redundant procedures. One friend of mine at Bethel once quipped that old unmarried Bethelites are so strange because all of the unused semen goes to the brain and causes damage. Perhaps someone here could apply for a federal grant to conduct a study. (sorry, examination gloves and talcum powder not included)